Almera GTi Performance Upgrade options...

J

JimmyBoy

Hi,

Newbie here, so apologies for some dumb questions, ive done a search for the information that im trying to obtain, with some success, but get a little lost with some of the terminology / acronyms!

I dont actually own an almera yet, but am seriously considering getting one, with the view to improve its performance over time, and as funds dictate.

I would want to turbo it at some point, and im just trying to figure out what my options are, and also what option may give the best bang for the buck (I dont have a money tree unfortunately!!)

I see these possible options

1) SR20DE+T
Basically, adding a turbo to my current engine and running low boost (about 7 psi?) and being done with it (I realise there is more involved, but im just trying to summarise)

2) SR20DE+T with uprated internals
Same as option one, but using forged rods/pistons and arp bolts etc..

3) SR20DET
Complete SR20DET engine transplant

4) SR20VET
Complete SR20VET transplant (I THINK these are quite hard to come by though ?)

5) SR20VE+T
SR20VE with turbo bolted on

6) SR20DVET (Dont know what to call it! lol)
SR20DE(T) block with SR20VE Head and turbo charged


I think the ideal option is option 4 (SR20VET Transplant), as I am led to believe that is a better block (dont know why, apart from oil squirters?), and obviously its got the neo vvl head too. However, im unsure of how available these are (in the uk), and as to what sort of money they fetch, and also what sort of boost / power the stock internals of the engine can handle.

I think the option that seems most realistic to me though is a hybrid of option 2 and option 5, ie a DE block with uprated internals and a VE head, as I would think this would be good bang for buck, however im not sure if the VE head is a simple bolt on to the DE block or not, and also if the exhaust manifolds match.

Another thing im unsure about is, are any of the GTiR parts interchangable with the almera? ie, will the inlet manifold of the GTiR firtstraight on the the DE head of the almera, and would that manifold improve performance? also with regard to add a FMIC, would a pulsar item (complete kits on ebay) fit to the almera, or would it need to be custom made ?

One last thing, what options are there for strengthening the transmission that arent ££££££'s ??, are there any ?


Sorry for so many questions but ive had this going round in my head for a few days now and need to let it all out! lol

Thanks in advance :D
 
Lot's of q's and only really 3 I know proper answers too.

GtiR inlet manifolds will not fit a DE/VE head without modification. The DET heads are different.

VE heads aren't that available in the UK but you can ship them from america / japan and there's a few in ireland too. Expect to pay good money though.

The strongest box available is the primera p11-114 box. There's around 5 SR20DE+T's on the site and IIRC, I don't think any of them had had any problem with the gearboxes. They run between 250bhp-320bhp. What sort of power you looking for? Dave Bull has gone through several of the primera boxes with around 400bhp. User th3t3ym4ster knows a gentleman who will build gearboxes with custom gearsets including nismo lsd's etc. It's £££ but if you're serious about a build like this, it could be worth it.
 
Kristian on here offers a complete turbo kit for your SR20DE using the GTi-Rs T28 turbo...

Pretty good system for the money, you get a drive(150bhp) in and then drive out (250-350bhp) service (a week or so)

Pretty cheap option too...he doesnt charge that much top do it
 
Till any of these DE+T's last a decent length of time to prove thier reliability, I won't be jumping on that bandwagon just yet.
 
Oh but a F/I SR20 is sooo much fun :D That's my opinion after driving one a couple of times.
 
JimmyBoy said:
I think the ideal option is option 4 (SR20VET Transplant), as I am led to believe that is a better block (dont know why, apart from oil squirters?), and obviously its got the neo vvl head too. However, im unsure of how available these are (in the uk), and as to what sort of money they fetch, and also what sort of boost / power the stock internals of the engine can handle.

I think the option that seems most realistic to me though is a hybrid of option 2 and option 5, ie a DE block with uprated internals and a VE head, as I would think this would be good bang for buck, however im not sure if the VE head is a simple bolt on to the DE block or not, and also if the exhaust manifolds match.

Another thing im unsure about is, are any of the GTiR parts interchangable with the almera? ie, will the inlet manifold of the GTiR firtstraight on the the DE head of the almera, and would that manifold improve performance? also with regard to add a FMIC, would a pulsar item (complete kits on ebay) fit to the almera, or would it need to be custom made ?

One last thing, what options are there for strengthening the transmission that arent ££££££'s ??, are there any ?


Sorry for so many questions but ive had this going round in my head for a few days now and need to let it all out! lol

Thanks in advance :D
Click to expand...

right.. forget about buying a VET i have only ever seen one for sale that was in america.. they never sold this engine outside of japan and only in limited numbers anyway..

what you want to do is buy a 20VE from the states.. www.SR20-forum.com talk to Greg at Gspec or andreas miko they can get you a good VE,

you can then use all the same bits you would use to turbo a DE on the VE.. a standard SR20VE will take 10PSi mapped properly with a T28 and will make alot of power..

also VE oil pumps and bottom ends are better than the standard DE's and its a ball ache to put a VE head on a DE its possible but you need to drill and tap the head to take a new oilway to activate the cams ect.

GTiR inlet manifold as mentioned wont fit anything other than a GTiR. GTiR rods are stronger and have a 19mm bearing so are better and will fit the SR20 crank.

The crank from a pulsar but you need to use a pulsar flywheel as the normal DE/VE one doesnt fit the gtir crank..

basically how much money have you got? its so much easyer the other way around tell us your budget and we can tell you what you can have.. :)
 
Thanks for the replies guys, really appreciate it.

Let me try another, simpler question then :

If you was going to turbo your almera, would you opt for a bolt on turbo package for your current DE, or would you drop in a DET block instead.

Does a DET block / head give us access to some of the fancy stuff you see on ebay, like inlets, exhasut manifolds and such like, or will they fit the DE block to ?

Oh and just one other quickie - when you guys quote horsepower, are you referring to wheel or crank horsepower (I presume crank horsepower)

Thanks again!!!
 
Thanks raceworx, you replied while I was typing :D

As for budget, bearing in mind that I would be planning on doing this over a period of some time, not a one week job, then I would say I would be willing to spend £3000 - £3500 on performance upgrades.
 
there are 2 types of DET motor.. theres the FWD DET and a RWD DET the RWD DET is what you see all the bits for on ebay fancy inlets manifolds ect unless it specifically mentiones its for a pulsar it wont fit. the only FWD DET available in the uk is a pulsar GTiR engine.. so your choices are GTiR engine conversion or a DE+T

you carnt simply put the GTiR engine in the almera it uses different electronics injectors ect it can be done but you need to sort the electrics out somthing id steer clear of especially when its so easy to make a DE-T

if we say BHP we mean crank if we say WHP we mean at the wheels..
 
£3500 would et you a fully forged SR20DE+T with a good GT2871R turbo and make more power than you need so go with that you could imprt a VE with 3.5K but you wont turbo it aswell
 
I already have a GT28RS "Disco Potato" brand new, but am considering selling this for something with slightly more bhp potential, undecided as of yet. But if you know anyone after a brand new GT28RS then, im your man! lol
 
Raceworx said:
there are 2 types of DET motor.. theres the FWD DET and a RWD DET the RWD DET is what you see all the bits for on ebay fancy inlets manifolds ect unless it specifically mentiones its for a pulsar it wont fit. the only FWD DET available in the uk is a pulsar GTiR engine.. so your choices are GTiR engine conversion or a DE+T

you carnt simply put the GTiR engine in the almera it uses different electronics injectors ect it can be done but you need to sort the electrics out somthing id steer clear of especially when its so easy to make a DE-T

if we say BHP we mean crank if we say WHP we mean at the wheels..
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bugger, I had a sneaking suspicion that there may be a FWD and RWD version of the DET and all the fancy bits where for the RWD version !! :(

Could you advise on what route to take for a FMIC, would one designed for a GTiR fit / almost fit, or would it have to be a custom job ?

Thanks so much for your help :D
 
dave doesnt run a disco potato.. he runs a some sort of hybrid.. alot bigger than a disco

the GT2871R is bigger than a disco potato and just as quick to spool up there the pwerect turbo for a 400BHP SR20 which is more than enough..

GTiR FMIC fits fine.. works well thats what everyone else uses..
 
PS i know its pot calling kettle black but if you sign up to become a full member there are shit loads of information threads you carnt see that would have you sorted in seconds..
 
Guys, youve been really great, without slagging off any of my questions, thank you.

Could I just push on to some other things I was wondering about ;

1) Is it a characteristic of the VE head, to rev harder, and if so, what does it redline at, and can this be increased (safely) ?

2) Ive heard that 16VE cams are meant to be better than the 20VE cams? can anyone testify to this ?

3) Can the point at which the vvl kicks in be changed ? (ie, I think the stock intake is about 6000 rpm, and exhaust about 6800 rpm? but I may be totally wrong)

4) ECU - Does this need to be exchanged for a DET / VE / VET ECU depending on the route chosen, or can the DE ecu remain in use with some sort of piggyback device ?

Thanks so much again, and sorry for the bombardment of questions!!
 
JimmyBoy said:
Guys, youve been really great, without slagging off any of my questions, thank you.

Could I just push on to some other things I was wondering about ;

1) Is it a characteristic of the VE head, to rev harder, and if so, what does it redline at, and can this be increased (safely) ?

2) Ive heard that 16VE cams are meant to be better than the 20VE cams? can anyone testify to this ?

3) Can the point at which the vvl kicks in be changed ? (ie, I think the stock intake is about 6000 rpm, and exhaust about 6800 rpm? but I may be totally wrong)

4) ECU - Does this need to be exchanged for a DET / VE / VET ECU depending on the route chosen, or can the DE ecu remain in use with some sort of piggyback device ?

Thanks so much again, and sorry for the bombardment of questions!!
Click to expand...

1) the head doesnt mean the engine can rev more it just means you can make more power at higher revs as you can have a set of lairy cams and a set of sensible cams in the same engine.. its the bottom end of an engine that dictates how high it can rev.. so if you build the right bottom end you can rev SR20's till the cows come home..

2) 16VE cams are better its a proven fact N1 cams are even better than 16VE cams

3) yes its only a switch it can be changed to kick in whenever you want but it wont make it have more power..

4) the standard ECU can be remapped to do whatever you want it to... there are a few people that can do this
 
Raceworx said:
1) the head doesnt mean the engine can rev more it just means you can make more power at higher revs as you can have a set of lairy cams and a set of sensible cams in the same engine.. its the bottom end of an engine that dictates how high it can rev.. so if you build the right bottom end you can rev SR20's till the cows come home..
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The only reason I ask is because alot of the videos ive seen on youtube of vvl's, they always seem to rev higher, upto about 8.5 - 9k, maybe ive just been watching videos of vvl's where the block has also been uprated.
 
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